In short, I love WoW but I believe I need to quit for now. This is one of the rare times where despite the fact I'm enjoying myself, it could be time best spent invested somewhere else
but when you boil it down, it's truly a bunch of friendly-minded people doing the same scenarios over and over again over a significantly long period. This sounds negative, and it is, but please know that I have enjoyed my time raiding. I did not find it unpleasurable, but now I feel it doesn't match the kind of give and take required in order to have it take up a worthwhile portion of my personal time.
You have the at least superficially-appearing life circumstances to consistently surge forward into endagame with open arms and a full budget of time and affiliated resources at your disposal... By rights, this is your time to take your character as far as she will go and I wish you the best in that endeavor. I respect that.
You have a drive unmatched, and a positive attitude to resurrect even the most hopeless of groups in dire circumstances.
I feel that the way WoW demands people to play is in direct conflict with the very nature of how we originally and quite honestly used to interact with each other. We've become splintered between those who play casually ... [and those who play] ... through a combination of gear and reputation-grinding with whoever is able to catch up long enough to keep pace.
While tense situations and disagreements over these issues have been resolved and taken care of for the most part, people have being hurt and people have been excluded no matter who or what is responsible. To be blunt again, they should never have happened in the first place, regardless of how committed anyone is to any stance, either for or against habitual raiding. I do not expect a state of perfection but I want something better than this. So, coupled with my own personal conflicts and objections, I feel it is time for me to go.
I want to play with Clan Plaid, but I want to it to be an experience that is non-exclusionary.
I want to be able to play a game that rewards the sacrifices I make not with repetitive motion and a token item celebrated by a select few, but with the knowledge I'm experiencing something special and fun with ALL of my friends, who I respect so very much.
Waluin said:And to be perfectly blunt, one of the fundamental concerns I had was that some do see endgame as a race to tier 3 loot, while others do not.
Waluin said:The problem is, you deal in specific events and in paritcular items of loot. I could honestly care less about any of those things. Which I suppose, after a fashion, somewhat confuses me a bit. Half of your reply is citing things I didn't particularly mean to say and some I cannot fathom at all. Though I know it may be hard to believe, I have no particular or specific gripe about you.As to parts where I did mention you, directly or indirectly, thanks for the insight. I stand corrected, though in all honestly you need not defend anything.
I didn't mean to sound so detailed, and for that I apologize.
The most active of us have Blighted to raid with and pursue the truly 1337 gear and most challenging game content.
If anyone wants to raid... anyone ... sign up for it.
[quote]to be perfectly blunt, one of the fundamental concerns I had was that some do see endgame as a race to tier 3 loot, while others do not.
Sorry for stirring the pot I guess.
Carch said:There is nothing, I repeat nothing more challenging about end game raids, when compared with 5 man dungeons and PVP. Rep grinding, maybe, but that depends entirely on how you play it. Raiders are not "better" at the game than non-raiders. And that's what that statement implies. Translates in my head to: "Hey, no biggie, if you can't handle the most challenging game content, that's cool." I realize you probably didn't intend it that way, but it's condescending at best.
The nature of raiding is inherently exclusive. It is tied to a strict schedule which even I--who often play WoW more hours than most, because I'm disabled--can not adhere. It's very hard for me to make Blighted raids because they are scheduled at the exact same time I'm doing family things. Raids are so time-intensive that no matter how you schedule them, they will exclude some people. It's not that us non-raiders feel we're not part of the raid clique, it's primarily that we can't be available when raids are happening.Smaller dungeons, non-Alterac PVP, and questing activities can happen at any time, on a whim, and anyone can participate. You can't get 20 or 40 people together without a schedule.
Huh. You could have fooled me. And DL. And sometimes even Vrag has expressed Wally's frustration. It sure as hell looks to us like there are guild members who are more into chasing loot than partying with their fellow guildies.
That's the core of the problem, if you ask me. And I don't see it going away, because it's a fundamental difference in play style.
Carch said:There is nothing, I repeat nothing more challenging about end game raids, when compared with 5 man dungeons and PVP. Rep grinding, maybe, but that depends entirely on how you play it. Raiders are not "better" at the game than non-raiders. And that's what that statement implies.
It's not your problem. It's my problem. I want to be part of a group where I feel like I fit in. In this guild, there isn't enough activity that lines up with my needs. Didn't used to be that way, but it is now.
Another point I was trying to make is that some of the seperateness I'm feeling seems intentional. Chief and others say otherwise, but you know... actions, meet words.
Carch said:All day today, raiding. Not to sound sappy or anything, but I actually had to turn guild chat off because the Onyxia banter was really making me feel left out.
Carch said:One point that I didn't make, but which is still buggin me is what appears to be the reaction to dissatisfaction. Maybe I'm romanticizing the "good old days" but it seems to me that the general reaction to someone in the group with a problem didn't used to be "What do you expect us to do?" It was more along the lines of "How can we make this right?"
Deacon's shown more of what I would expect, with the suggestion for scheduling, and maybe it's something just that simple. When people are leaving the guild, or just having second thoughts about sticking around, though, seems to me the "for FUN and HONOR" response is not "well, don't let the door hit you on the ass..." or "that's the way it is, suck it up", or "I guess this game just isn't for you."
Carch said:Maybe I'm romanticizing the "good old days" but it seems to me that the general reaction to someone in the group with a problem didn't used to be "What do you expect us to do?" It was more along the lines of "How can we make this right?"
Chief said:I would like to nominate Deacon for "best posts in this thread". I'm in 100% agreement with everything he's posted, and he's done a far better job than I. Kudos!
Darklord said:Let me see if I can elaborate on what Carch is saying by telling you of my WoW experience
Before I start up WoW, I check our forums. I look at CoE and Blighted's raid signup forums. And what do I see? Every raid has like 4 or more CP signed up for every upcoming raid. This is fine, but when would they have time for anything else I wonder? Every time I log in and there are CP on, everyone is in a raid of some kind. This ties them up for like 4 hours at a pop, with not much time before or afterwards for anything else.
I have a 300 skill armorsmith. Honestly, no one cares. I can make stuff - but no one wants it. I can even make fire resist gear, but no one has more than a passing "oh cool" before it's forgotten. I had advanced his skill so he'd hopefully be useful to the guild, but the guild has no use for him.
I work on my alt - advancing his enchanting skills. Thinking he might be more usefull instead. However, there are 2 problems:1) the guild doesn't use Guildadds.
2) the guild doesn't seem to help itself as a whole.
Being in the guild is just a chat channel for me.I constanly kick around the idea of leaving. I want to be part of something more than myself I suppose.
Vragak said:Footnotes:"...despite more paragraphs than most posts have sentences..." ~Deacon,Paragraph (n.) 1. A distinct division of written or printed matter that begins on a new, usually indented line, consists of one or more sentences, and typically deals with a single thought or topic or quotes one speaker's continuous words.When I start a new thought, I'm gonna start a new paragraph, deal with it. I thought most people enjoyed proper grammar. (No, I am not perfect nor do I think I am at grammar). Thanks for the compliment though, I appreciated it.
The Sweedish Chef' said:bork bork bork